Security? LOLOL

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C_D
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Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:18 am

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... nerability

LOL!!!! Every processor made by Intel (at least - maybe more) has a critical vulnerability. LMFAO! For AT LEAST the last 10 years!

There is no such thing as 'security' with regards to anything with a microprocessor chip in it. :lol:

Can't wait to see the private communications of the rich and powerful that have been collected since this flaw was introduced! Some serious shit must be about to be released for Intel to have had to admit it! FAN FUCKING TASTIC.

An aside : this is some serious shit. I love the way the Bllomberg correspondant, Ian King, is desperately trying to play it all down, saying Intel must be taken at their word - it's not just Intel, it's everybody - that the solution is a greater thing to deal with than the accusations (which are not explained) - I wonder how much he gets paid by Intel to cover their arse on TV?

Everything ever written on, or transmitted through an Intel processor HAS TO BE assumed compromised. LOL!

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:41 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-42553818
"Experts have said that the fix could slow down the performance of computers by up to 30% but Intel played this down"
Kiss goodbye to 60-100 fps framerates! There are going to be a lot of very pissed off gamers.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:19 pm

The implications of this flaw are staggering. Every piece of information stored digitally anywhere has been compromised for at least a decade.

Why release this admission now? This flaw has supposedly been known about for months (if it wasn't an intentional back-door from the outset).

Could it possibly be used as an excuse to enact an iron grip on the internet? The Control System is under inordinate pressure and has to find ways to suppress dissent - and as wonderful for control as social media is, the wrong thought and subsequent word of truth can spread like wildfire across a platform such as facebook and twitter, contrary to it's controllers wishes. These things must have been considered.

Wow, 2018 has started with a bang.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:05 pm

https://communities.intel.com/thread/121119

Should be interesting to watch this one develop.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:37 pm

Understanding Meltdown & Spectre: What To Know About New Exploits That Affect Virtually All CPUs
by Ryan Smith on January 4, 2018 11:45 AM EST

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12214/un ... nd-spectre

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:51 pm

I feel slightly naughty mentioning this, but if they were designed with the flaw for backdoor entrance by various Western acronym Intel agencies, it may be of interest to note where the architecture was developed.
Israel Inside: A history of Intel's R&D in Israel
By David Shamah for Tel Aviv Tech | August 28, 2012 -- 09:44 GMT (10:44 BST) |

There are dozens of multinationals with development centres in Israel, but no company has embraced the idea of Israeli-based R&D more than Intel.

With four design centres and two fabrication plants, Intel is Israel's largest private-sector employer, with about 8,000 direct workers. As the biggest tech company in Israel, it is responsible for much of the country's hi-tech ecosystem, with one out of every 10 people in tech working either directly or peripherally for projects associated with Intel.
intel haifa
Intel's R&D center in Haifa, Israel Image credit: Intel

Operating in Israel since 1974, some of Israel's most important products were conceived, designed, and manufactured in Israel, according to Rony Friedman, Intel corporate vice president and general manager of the Intel Architecture Development Group (IADGz).

"Intel Israel's biggest contribution has been in the development of microprocessors, which are being used in a wide variety of products, for desktop, mobile, and workstation solutions," says Friedman. "We also do work on connectivity products and security technologies here, as well as development of digital devices."

Among the technologies recently worked on by the Israeli team are Cedarview, Intel's new processor for netbooks, and Cloverview, the processor that will be used in the new Windows 8 tablets due later this year.

Intel stars

The first Intel product to put Israel "on the map", says Friedman, was Banias, better known as the Pentium M microprocessor , the microprocessor introduced in 2003 that arguably kicked off the notebook era.

Another important product that, like Banias, was conceived, designed, directed and manufactured in Israel, was Merom, the Core-2 notebook processor heir of the Pentium M. Introduced in 2006, Merom was the first Intel technology to produce a microprocessor for mobile, desktop, and server products, according to Friedman. "Merom especially helped boost Intel's stature in the server market," Friedman says.

And of course, there are the current Intel stars: the Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge family of processors, all designed, manufactured, and managed by the Israel team.

At a recent press conference, Intel revealed that Sandy Bridge was responsible for 40 percent of the company's sales worldwide in 2011.

Upcoming projects

The more complicated products get, the more likely it is that teams from around the Intel world — notably the US and India, as well as Israel — will be working on products together, Friedman says.

That appears to be the case with the upcoming Haswell processors: though they were largely designed in the US, the 22nm tri-gate 3D transistors inside them (and which are already in use in Ivy Bridge processors) are made in Israel, at Kiryat Gat's Fab 28 plant.

"Within five years all of the human senses will be in computers, and in 10 years we will have more transistors in one chip than neurons in the human brain" — Mooly Eden

And, although it appears that Intel is prepping its fab in Ireland to manufacture its next-generation 14nm transistors, there will be plenty of action for Intel Israel, both in development and manufacturing.

"We have numerous future technologies that we are already working on in Israel, although of course I can't discuss them, since they haven't been announced," says Friedman.

Some of those technologies could include enhancing video streaming — building on the Intel WiDi (wireless display) technology developed by Intel Israel; enhanced connectivity using Thunderbolt (or other connectivity technologies), also largely developed in Israel; and enhancements to Intel's security software (Intel's IPT — Identity Protection Technology — was developed in Israel).

It could even include new areas that Intel is apparently exploring, based on recent acquisitions, such as that of navigation software maker Telmap — one of several Israeli start-ups that Intel has snapped up in recent years.

Computational intelligence
Intel's Rony Friedman

Or, perhaps, development could focus on the new field of computational intelligence, defining interactions between humans and computers.

In May, Intel announced that it was establishing the Collaborative Research Institute for Computational Intelligence in Israel, focusing on applying machine learning, brain-inspired computation and advanced computer architecture to software.

"Within five years all of the human senses will be in computers, and in 10 years we will have more transistors in one chip than neurons in the human brain," says Mooly Eden, president of Intel Israel. "The expectations from the Institute for Computational Intelligence is that it will provide a leap forward in research and in ideas that will be translated into products and applications."

Whatever the future brings for Intel, its Israel facilities will remain a large part of the company's strategy, according to Friedman: "If Intel had had any doubts about Israel, whether financial, personnel-oriented, or security-oriented, they would not have continued to build the company's relationship with Israel."

http://www.zdnet.com/article/israel-ins ... in-israel/

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by jakell » Fri Jan 05, 2018 1:17 pm

C_D wrote:
Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:41 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-42553818
"Experts have said that the fix could slow down the performance of computers by up to 30% but Intel played this down"
Kiss goodbye to 60-100 fps framerates! There are going to be a lot of very pissed off gamers.
Graphics should be largely unaffected as the graphics card handles all that. There'll be some background CPU stuff that will be affected but most games include options to tweak reliance on the CPU so the 'smoothness' of gameplay should be unaltered.

I use Linux and patched kernels are already available, it's just a matter of getting one 'bedded in', I'll report any any slowdowns but I'm not a power user and am used to working around resource shortages anyway, I don't expect to notice much difference.
I trust the open-source nature of Linux updates as there are plenty of eyes on them. Updates from Microsoft are relatively mysterious and, if you are using Windows10, their arrival and installing is automatic and beyond the user's control.. many initial reports of slowdowns will be due to automatic updates clogging internet connections and installation happening in the background whilst using the computer.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Fri Jan 05, 2018 5:54 pm

Intel CEO sold shares before disclosure of chip security flaw

http://www.dw.com/en/intel-ceo-sold-sha ... a-42039271

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:43 pm

LOL - they even called the company INTEL

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by jakell » Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:57 pm

C_D wrote:
Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:51 pm
I feel slightly naughty mentioning this, but if they were designed with the flaw for backdoor entrance by various Western acronym Intel agencies, it may be of interest to note where the architecture was developed.
The notion that this was designed as a "backdoor" is tempting to conspiracy minded folks but in this case there are simpler motivations.

A decade ago (coinciding with the introduction of the dodgy processors), there was a fair bit of rivalry between Intel and AMD and AMD was winning becuase intel could only compete by souping up their current chips so much that they gave off a lot of heat.. an unsatisfactory situation, especially for laptop users.

Intel's new line after that became more competitive because the chips primed certain data pipelines with 'likely' sets of instructions and data via an 'educated guess'. The trouble is that this makes the data accessible to cleverly designed malware**.. it's not easy to get at and has to be 'mined' for, but it's possible.
Therefore, this problem came about because Intel made a design tweak in order to become more competitive.

**Ironically, this malware only starts to work well with the advent of high processing power.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:05 am

jakell said:
The notion that this was designed as a "backdoor" is tempting to conspiracy minded folks but in this case there are simpler motivations.

A decade ago (coinciding with the introduction of the dodgy processors), there was a fair bit of rivalry between Intel and AMD and AMD was winning becuase intel could only compete by souping up their current chips so much that they gave off a lot of heat.. an unsatisfactory situation, especially for laptop users.

Intel's new line after that became more competitive because the chips primed certain data pipelines with 'likely' sets of instructions and data via an 'educated guess'. The trouble is that this makes the data accessible to cleverly designed malware**.. it's not easy to get at and has to be 'mined' for, but it's possible.
Therefore, this problem came about because Intel made a design tweak in order to become more competitive.

**Ironically, this malware only starts to work well with the advent of high processing power.
You sound like the PR department of Intel.

These processors have been proven - quite accidently, I might add - and accidently is the key word here - to give up the secrets contained in an area of the central processor which Intel has assured the entire world to be an impregnable fortress. For the last 20 years.

This flaw completely negates any and all digital security measures put in place by anyone, anywhere - for the last 20 years.

You can say I'm wrong, you can follow the party line - but let me assure you, this revelation smells like a prelude to something much, much bigger.

Hidden In Plain Sight is failing.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by jakell » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:46 am

It takes a lot of digging, and processing power to get at those 'secrets'. The chip doesn't "give them up".

If one takes the 'slowdown' provided by the patch, then there shouldn't be any problems provided by this particular** flaw. I can only speak for Linux though.. Microsoft's patches are closed source and have to be taken solely on trust. Anyone who is suspicious about these things would be an utter fool to continue using Windows products, especially Windows10 which downloads and 'installs' updates without any possibility of control from the user.

** Other 'flaws' can be imagined though, but I prefer to deal with the known.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by Pauli137 » Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:51 pm

jakell wrote:
Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:46 am
It takes a lot of digging, and processing power to get at those 'secrets'. The chip doesn't "give them up".

If one takes the 'slowdown' provided by the patch, then there shouldn't be any problems provided by this particular** flaw. I can only speak for Linux though.. Microsoft's patches are closed source and have to be taken solely on trust. Anyone who is suspicious about these things would be an utter fool to continue using Windows products, especially Windows10 which downloads and 'installs' updates without any possibility of control from the user.

** Other 'flaws' can be imagined though, but I prefer to deal with the known.
Is there no way to control the flow of Windows 10 updates?

I've been sitting on a Windows 7 machine for years, and while it's still very functional, every other computing device in our household is dysfunctional in some way (including the machine I was using to test Linux). At some point I'm going to have to buy something new and commercial, but I'm mortally afraid of Windows 10, Mac doesn't work for me in a few critical circumstances, and Linux hasn't worked for me either. Any thoughts?

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by jakell » Sat Jan 06, 2018 8:43 pm

Pauli137 wrote:
Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:51 pm
jakell wrote:
Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:46 am
It takes a lot of digging, and processing power to get at those 'secrets'. The chip doesn't "give them up".

If one takes the 'slowdown' provided by the patch, then there shouldn't be any problems provided by this particular** flaw. I can only speak for Linux though.. Microsoft's patches are closed source and have to be taken solely on trust. Anyone who is suspicious about these things would be an utter fool to continue using Windows products, especially Windows10 which downloads and 'installs' updates without any possibility of control from the user.

** Other 'flaws' can be imagined though, but I prefer to deal with the known.
Is there no way to control the flow of Windows 10 updates?

I've been sitting on a Windows 7 machine for years, and while it's still very functional, every other computing device in our household is dysfunctional in some way (including the machine I was using to test Linux). At some point I'm going to have to buy something new and commercial, but I'm mortally afraid of Windows 10, Mac doesn't work for me in a few critical circumstances, and Linux hasn't worked for me either. Any thoughts?
No, I've looked into this from all possible angles for a friend who was experiencing a 'saturated' internet connection plus slow performance.
Windows10 downloads and installs updates without giving the user a choice. With Windows 7 and 8.1 you still had this option but with Windows10 this is gone, W10 gives you a 'metered connection' option which probably slows them somewhat, but you can't turn them off.

There's worse news though.. there's an update for W7 and W8.1 that starts downloading W10 files and starts conversion to that OS, the only way to prevent this is to spot the update and tell the computer not to install it, or turn off updates completely. I forget the number of the update (it'll be KB*******) but you can probably look this up as Windows users are pissed off about this.

If you need Windows for one or two crucial apps I recommend installing Linux (LinuxMint is a good one) alongside it for dual booting. The Linux installer walks you through this process and it's not too hard.
One more swipe at W10... it changes the disk partitions so that dual booting is made harder to set up. it's still possible but Microsoft seemed to introduce this just out of spite

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by jakell » Sun Jan 07, 2018 5:47 pm

I've just taken the plunge and purchased an AMD based setup.

I would be ok with the patched OS, even with the slowdowns, but my all my boards have Intel chipsets too and I don't think the 'partnership' of these with an Intel CPU has been looked at yet. So soon I'll be running an AMD CPU with an Nvidia chipset (in this case) and a Linux OS. Hopefully the Linux patch is selectively applied and won't be applied to an AMD system too.

Relating to the Windows musings above, I still use Windows on a secondary computer for games, graphics and video editing, but I don't let it on the Internet, which is where all the security issues come from, My Linux system is the only one I let on the internet. I'm going to apply the same philosophy to my Intel machines - those will be used for the secondary system.
This is probably the best solution to those who need Windows for particular apps that they are dependent on.. have a separate machine as a Workstation. I run the two side by side and they are networked and ..solution for W10 users might be to block the source of Updates (Microsoft) in the firewall.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Sun Jan 07, 2018 6:08 pm

I've just taken the plunge and purchased an AMD based setup.
So after all that Intel PR horseshit you regurgitated above, you've rushed out and bought yourself an AMD processor.

LOL.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by jakell » Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:01 pm

C_D wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 6:08 pm
I've just taken the plunge and purchased an AMD based setup.
So after all that Intel PR horseshit you regurgitated above, you've rushed out and bought yourself an AMD processor.

LOL.
It's the Intel chipset that is the unknown quantity IMO.. that isn't being looked at (yet). However, with the AMD processor hopefully I won't get the slowdown.

I think you should read what I wrote again. What I said wasn't kind to Intel at all, it was a closer look at the problem.

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:04 pm

We'll beg to differ on this one.
I wouldn't get too used to having a secure AMD processor just yet - I feel there's more to come. :-)

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by jakell » Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:18 pm

C_D wrote:
Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:04 pm
We'll beg to differ on this one.
I wouldn't get too used to having a secure AMD processor just yet - I feel there's more to come. :-)
There are three (related) bugs, one major one and two minor ones. The AMD processor negates the first two so I shouldn't incur the slowdown.
However, I'm certainly not complacent which is why I'm taking steps and that is the way to approach things. I'm also documenting the process in the spirit of open source.

Your turn now.. what steps are you taking?

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Re: Security? LOLOL

Post by C_D » Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:51 pm

None. Never have. I realised 30 years ago, after taking a course in Cobol at college, that 'security' in a digital context was meaningless.

Also, there was a video (can't be arsed to find it - it's dry, technical and features a Norwegian (I think) mathemetician explaining why the algebraic expression used as the backbone of the entire internet security googleplex is hopelessly compromised - incidentally, did you know that the NIST (https://www.nist.gov/) is responsible for this particular algebra - and that there is absolutely no such thing as a secure connection, transaction or messaging system via the internet as we know it. But I already knew that.

Information is power. And boy, are we going to see some of that power wielded shortly.

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